Was OVA Yosho Legitimate?

That particular scene has bothered me at different times. One would think that if Azusa had all these ties to Earth, he would be more understanding of his son, as well as one of his wives. Moreover, there’s the issue of Yosho having a Terran wife and apparently being married to Airi. Again, OVA series 2 and 3 seem to clash with series 1, so I disregard them in this discussion. Kiyofacepalm1

Thus in my view, as has been presented before, this is further proof that Tenchi could very well have gone another way, and what we are seeing via Hasegawa’s novels and these remnants still leftover within the first OVA itself are the blueprints of a long forgotten–or in the case of Western fandom, completely unknown–example of “what could have been” of a profound (even arguably, poignant) nature.

But again, if a hardened and knowledgeable fan can find the ability within themselves to look at things conceptually through fresh eyes, when you enter these inputs things instantly make sense; they add simple, usually-taken-for-granted coherence to the framework and plot surrounding Jurai and Yosho’s motives.

It could even explain why the unobtrusive Yosho would not assert his right for the throne…there’s the angle we all know–that he simply didn’t want it–but what if there was more to it…what if he didn’t believe he had the right?

Well said, and this is why I have been very eager to see Hasegawa’s second and third novels translated. Like with Tenchi and the others in Hexagram, Hasegawa might treat us to Yosho’s thoughts as he is fighting Ryoko or leaving Jurai. We could see the conflict in his heart between his duty to the court and his need to be free from the prejudice on Jurai.

whether Ayeka’s mother would truly approve of such a union,

That is a damn good question. Misaki in Hexagram seems fine with Katsuhito’s presence, though after 700 years, she might have learned to accept this “other woman’s son” in her house. I do wonder if perhaps like Abraham and Sarah in Genesis, Misaki could not have children for whatever reason and told Azusa to make an heir with someone else for sake of the throne. However, like Sarah bearing Isaac, Misaki eventually gave birth to Ayeka and later Sasami. I might be digging too deep without any backing from the novels or anime. butts1

Funaho of possibly being a consort reminds me of Jeanne Antoinette Poisson, Madame de Pompadour, Mistress of King Louis XV of France.

This is possible, though notice that Funaho is never mentioned in Hexagram. That was my question earlier as to why Funaho would not be present if she was in a position of power like Madame de Pompadour. If she had such power, why would she not follow her “husband” to see her son after 700 years?

Examine Hexagram of Love , and compare it to “Night Before the Carnival”, the interlude between the first two OVA series, and “Here Comes Jurai”, OVA series 2 episode 6. All of them share notable characteristics. Mihoshi contacts the Galaxy Police with an event report on Kagato’s defeat. The monarchs of the Jurai royal family arrive to discuss the situation with their offspring. While “Night Before the Carnival” and Here Comes Jurai” has Nobeyama merely relaying information to Jurai, Hexagram has Nobeyama join Anderson and Marshall Kuramitsu in visiting Earth, interacting with Azusa and the other powerplayers present. However, Hexagram predates “Night Before the Carnival” by over 6 months, and “Here Comes Jurai” by over 20 months.

With all these similarities, with all these important people coming to Earth, where is Funaho in Hexagram? If she had been of importance in the Jurai royal family, I believe she would have been present in Hexagram. However, her absence leads me to believe that she was not. Perhaps the next two novels will disprove this hypothesis. I await evidence to either conclusion. gendo1

In Here Comes Jurai, Azusa had stated he had chosen Seiryo Tennan to marry Ayeka, which in his opinion was suited for the throne of Jurai. Seiryo is from a highly distinguished family and having Ayeka married off to someone high class is easier than having Yosho marrying her, I think.

To be honest, Azusa says that Seiryo would be more suited to the elder princess, not to being seated on the throne.

http://i1345.photobucket.com/albums/p661/evilpii/Forum/Capture_zpsdokys2fj.png" />

http://i1345.photobucket.com/albums/p661/evilpii/Forum/Capture3_zpsukfrhzui.png" />

Hence, I find it unlikely that Seiryo was meant to be Azusa’s successor, particularly considering where he lands by the time GXP rolls around. Even then, “Here Comes Jurai” has little to do with Hexagram, save perhaps a copying of the novel’s motifs and ideas.

Again, OVA series 2 and 3 seem to clash with series 1, so I disregard them in this discussion. Kiyofacepalm1

Even then, “Here Comes Jurai” has little to do with Hexagram, save perhaps a copying of the novel’s motifs and ideas.

The point of this discussion is precisely on how the screenwriter for OVA series 1 and continuation novelist, Naoko Hasegawa, portrayed Yosho. Since the works of character designer Masaki Kajishima immediately conflict with hers, all of Kajishima’s material is irrelevant to this discussion and will be summarily ignored.

Nevertheless, AstroNerdBoy, I will address some of the points you have brought to light. Many of my comments will be about the following phrase.

If I recall correctly

This phrase should not be used when proving a point. If you have the facts to support your statement, cite them explicitly. Do not leave important facts to uncertainty. Show an officially licensed product of AIC that contains the evidence for your argument.

By “officially licensed”, I mean the anime, novels, games, CD dramas, and other products officially recognized by AIC, the company that owns the Tenchi Muyo! name. By definition, doujinshi are not official merchandise. Moreover, fan-made wikis and FAQs are also not official sources, particularly if they do not cite the sources of their information.

Specifically, the Tenchi Muyo FAQ claims that Kajishima has made particular statements, but does not say where or when he made such a declaration. Was this information in a novel, a doujin, an interview, or the anime? If so, which one is it and when was it published? If not, that information should be pulled until it can be verified. Moreover, the FAQ also quotes fans as sources, which are likewise not official. Furthermore, the FAQ states openly that its translation of the afterward to Hexagram has no source and cannot be trusted for its accuracy. This should not happen, particularly when a full and verifiable translation is now available. I am sure the translation team would like to hear what you have to say about their work.

The same goes for the Tenchi Wikia.

Why is citation important? Simply put, citation of sources makes your argument believable and allows corroboration by the reader. The internet is filled with false information, and showing the source of your information makes your argument more definitive and demonstrates its accuracy. Lack of sources is a hallmark of misinformation, leading inevitably to false conclusions.

Be aware that all legitimate research publications require citation of sources in manuscripts and subsequent drafts prior to publication. Moreover, all of them have a peer-review process where the results are verified by another expert in the field.

Naturally, many of the sources for Tenchi material are in Japanese, and most of us do not read Japanese. For example, the Shin Tenchi novels are not translated into English, so what should be done about information in these sources? Fortunately, this age has tools for this job. Google Translate, among other tools, can be used to make a rough translation that can be later refined. Why not paste the raw Japanese text and a proposed English translation? This provides full disclosure and opens discussion, though such a translation effort might be best relegated to the Translation Zone.

Personally, I have aimed for full disclosure in each post I have made in my research and speculation threads. I have provided screenshots and quotes from specific pages. If I have made an error, please correct me with an official source. I am human and often make mistakes, and I will accept that I am wrong, provided evidence to this fact is shown.

Why would Azusa pair his children in this way? Even Ayeka is aware that others would see the union as unusual or unnatural.

I theorize that Funaho was originally a consort, rather than a queen, and that Yosho was perhaps conceived or born out of wedlock. This would explain Misaki being addressed as “the Empress” in Hexagram. In this case, Yosho would not be a legitimate heir to the throne. Instead, Ayeka would be next in line. This would explain why a conflict would arise if Yosho stayed.

Azusa didn’t pair Yosho with Aeka. That was done by Funaho and Misaki. If I recall correctly, their reasoning for this was to further seal the bond within House Masaki since there had been problems with Azusa bringing this Earth girl from roughly the waring states period of Japan to Jurai, mainly because Azusa had been arranged to be married to Misaki by Misaki’s mother, Seto.

House Masaki was nearly extinct, so to preserve this former great house, Seto groomed a young Azusa. Azusa was much like the founder of Jurai in that he didn’t like being tied down. So after he came to Jurai, was chosen by the 1st generation royal tree Kirito and set out on his proving journey, he encountered Kagao and Ryoko. The battle that ensued was destructive and Tsunami had to intervene, sending Azusa to Earth. There, he met and fell in love with Funaho, and he saved her and her little sister from space pirates that were using as a hideout.

…

Regardless, while Earth was officially a colony of Jurai, Earth was a very primitive planet. So when Azusa brought her to Jurai, he was not only defying the powerful Seto and rejecting his arranged marriage, but he also dared bring a primitive and propose to marry her instead. In the end, a settlement was reached whereby Azusa was to marry both. Misaki was younger than Funaho and looked up to Funaho as a big sister (as I recall it). The two got along well, and after both had children, both agreed to the whacky notion of having Yosho marry Aeka.

Where did Hasegawa state this? This is not said in the anime or Hexagram. Source the original text.

However, I would assume this would be from Shin Tenchi Muyo: Jurai or Shin Tenchi Muyo: Yosho, both Kajishima’s works which are irrelevant to this discussion.

If Azusa wanted Yosho to take the throne…

Azusa had no say on whether Yosho took the throne or not. The politics of Jurai are not traditional in terms of the emperorship. The four royal houses of Jurai hold an election. To quote the FAQ,

Again, the FAQ is not an official source. Demonstrate an AIC licensed product with this information.

Now, the form of government you describe, an elective monarchy, does exist, most notably in Vatican City. However, Jurai has always been compared to ancient Japan, typically the Heian era as exemplified by Ayeka’s ideal world in Universe episode 11. Doing a little research, ancient Japan was not an elective monarchy, instead using a rotation amongst siblings and cousins. Even women could succeed the throne. However, the past 500 years show that preference for the firstborn son became the norm. If Jurai used an elective monarchy, this would break the comparison with ancient Japan.

What made Yosho first in line for the throne was his royal tree (whom he named after his mother, Funaho) was 1st generation. Yosho didn’t want this, which is why he used Ryoko’s attack on Jurai as an excuse

GXP episode 25 is where Seto states Seina is third in line to the throne. Her explanation is that he has bonded to the tree seed inside of the Zinv idol. She, however, does not explain why this makes him third in line.

http://i1345.photobucket.com/albums/p661/evilpii/Forum/vlcsnap-2015-04-03-17h56m14s14_zpsbpod8cfn.png" />

In the case that this is true, does this mean that OVA series 1 goes against Kajishima’s canon? Does that mean that OVA series 1 is not canon? If it is not, please define what canon is.

Ukinojo, I will tell you the same that I told AstroNerdBoy. Find the original source. Find who did the translation. Without a source, do not reference it.

Moreover, this translation credits Kajishima and Kuroda as the authors. Again, as stated four times, this thread is about Hasegawa’s work, not Kajishima’s. While the 101 Secrets might apply to other questions, it does not apply to the issues in Hasegawa’s works.

Physician, heal thyself.

Very well. I shall heal myself.

First, here is a point of fact. Recall that aicanime.com was the official English language front for AIC, so the translation given in that link is the official translation sanctioned by AIC itself. That is as official as it comes.

However, since you wanted the Japanese language, here it is from the Japanese language version of AIC’s website from the same era. Thanks be to Crazed for finding this elusive webpage.

——

まあ、あれだけタイプの違う個性の強い女性が揃っているから、想像力もたくましく

なりますよね。

あと、その女性キャラクター達に一人一人実際のモデルがいるかのような生命感は

【天地】の魅力のひとつですよね。

梶島：

いやあ、当然あれだけの数の個性的な女性たちに、明確なモデルというのは

いませんけど（笑）

ただまあ、それぞれが自分の理想の女性像ではありますね。

その中で（物語構成上の）バランスは当然、考えてはいますけど。

いうなれば【天地】という作品は、私がそれを始めるまでの３０年間ぐらいの

人生のリビドーの塊みたいな作品ですから（笑）

Here is what Google Translate produces.

–

Well, because the have all the strong women there only types of different personalities, imagination also strongly

I think you will.

After that, life feeling as if the women characters have to have each person the actual model

But it is one of the charms of [universe].

Kajishima:

Well, of course there only to unique women of the number of, of that clear model

And I do not have (laughs)

However Well, I can each have a female image of his ideal.

Among them (on the story configuration) balance of course, I have to think.

Yuunareba work called [heaven], I is about 30 years until start it

Because it is lump like a piece of libido of life (laughs)

Compare this to AIC’s official English translation.

T: Well, Tenchi Muyo! Ryo-Ohki stimulates people’s imaginations with a strong lineup of female characters, each with their own unique personality. Another reason it has attracted so many people is the fact that the female characters are so “real”, as if they are models in real life for each character.

K: Oh, of course there are no real models for that many different kinds of females with strong personalities. (laughs) But, all of them are my ideal women. And, of course, I did alter their personalities for balance when I composed the story. “Tenchi Muyo! Ryo-Ohki” is the manifestation of my libido for the past 30 years, before I started the series. (laughs)

Barring cleaning, the two agree. As said in the Did You Know Anime video, Kajishima stated there are no strong female personalities. However, his misogynistic statement is blatantly false.